Running Your Own Race feat. Brian Mininger

Brian Mininger 00:00:00 - 00:00:09
I've been the person suffering in silence. I've been the person that was suffering through the bankruptcy and very few people knew what was going on.
Wayne Herring 00:00:10 - 00:00:49
Welcome to the business Builder Way podcast, where we help business builders grow leadership skills and wisdom and stay grounded through business builder hero stories. So let's get after it. Hey, business builders. Today we are with Brian mininger of Bear Creek Outdoor living in Waynesboro, Virginia. And today we're going to talk about Brian's business builder journey, the goods, the bads, and how he's gotten through it. We're also going to talk about ultra running, and I'm excited about that. And Brian, I'm going to kick us off. I want to kind of drop right into a story and share with listeners what happened recently that brought us to this point.
Wayne Herring00:00:49 - 00:01:51
So a couple of weeks ago, I had been training and I was getting ready to go and do a half marathon on trail, which is 13.1 mile. And I was feeling fairly good about myself and feeling good about doing hard things. And I was thinking of how to tell the story, maybe in social media posts about why doing hard things benefits me and how I think it helps me be a better coach and business builder and dad and all those things. And I was on my way to get ready to leave and I looked on social media and I saw that Brian was doing 100 miles ultra marathon. And so thus ensued self talk and be like, oh my goodness, 13.1 mile, nothing. Brian's doing 100. And then that kind of quickly dissipated and I thought, no, running. My race is good and this is a good place to be.
Wayne Herring00:01:51 - 00:02:41
But I'm also very curious about how Brian, I knew Brian, I knew you ran a lot, but this was bigger than anything you'd ever done before. And as I was running 13.1 mile, well, that morning when I left, you had finished because I was checking. Then once I saw, I was like, all right, now I want to check and I want to see what happened. And I saw the pictures and posts that you had finished. And I got to my race and as I was running the race and was thinking about the things going on for me in my head, my self talk, I thought, brian is really going to have some things to share that will tie into his business journey and would be helpful to people listening. So that's what gets us here. We've known each other for a long time, but I'm really interested. You were sharing with me you had some things in the back page of your journal about reflections after the race.
Wayne Herring00:02:41 - 00:02:50
So if you could just kind of kick us off and take us on a bit of a journey with you and that race and tell us about the race. That would be awesome.
Brian Mininger00:02:50 - 00:03:34
Yeah. So this is kind of exciting for me. So I don't do a lot of podcasts in the world that I kind of live in business wise these days. However, I did podcast host for a number of episodes, like, eight, nine years ago, something like that. But I have never talked about ultra running on a podcast, so I'm kind of pumped about that. It's something that's kind of become a part of my life over the last few years, and it's something that has actually become a pretty important part of my life, I think. And so I've learned a lot from it. And I share that with people one on one as the conversations come up.
Brian Mininger00:03:34 - 00:03:47
Because when you tell people that you've run 100 miles, what is the number one question that comes back? Do you think, Wayne, what's the number one people ask you when you tell them you've run 100 miles?
Wayne Herring00:03:47 - 00:03:50
Well, I was thinking more like a statement, like, are you crazy?
Brian Mininger00:03:50 - 00:04:56
Right? It's some version of are you crazy? And why in the world would you do that? Which is a pretty open door to talk about, like, well, why in the world would I do this? Right? Anyway, so I'm kind of excited to dig into that a little bit, and I'll just give a little bit of backstory as to how I got to this point of running because it is significant for my journey. So I'm 46 years old. I was a high school athlete. I started in physical construction when I was young, and so I was pretty active and ate whatever I want to. Just kind of total neglect. Then over the years, I kind of shifted more and more into leadership and management and continued to just neglect my physical body. And over the years, I continued to gain weight and get in worse shape and so forth. And about seven or eight years ago, so my late thirty s, it was getting bad.
Brian Mininger00:04:58 - 00:05:38
I wasn't having major crisis issues, but I had no energy for life and no energy for the things that were important for me. And I felt like crap all the time. And I had a friend that in conversation challenged with, hey, we can't ever accomplish the purposes and plans that God has for our lives if our bodies can't handle the physical strain of it. And I just realized that physically, I was weak. I wanted to do great things, but physically I was weak. And so I started a journey of running. I literally could not run a mile. When I started, I was about 55 to 60 pounds heavier than I am today.
Brian Mininger00:05:40 - 00:06:28
And I still remember it was terrible. And so I signed up for a race so that I would keep going so I wouldn't quit because I knew I was somewhat competitive. And the first five k I did, I could not run the entire thing. And for those that don't know, five k is 3.1 mile. And so I probably ran about 60% of it, walked the other 40%, and it was super hard anyway. So the journey over the last few years has steadily longer and longer distances, because what I was doing was I was pushing myself to do something hard. And so once something became easy, then I needed to step up distance to continue to push myself to do something hard. And then in that kind of.
Brian Mininger00:06:28 - 00:07:31
That journey, led me to ultra trail running about three or four years ago. And that brought in a dynamic that I had never experienced in running up to that point, which was really the solitude and the peace and the thinking space that hours out in the woods would give me, because it's very different. When you're running for a five k, you go out and you run 2030 minutes, and then you go back inside, you run on the road. It was a very different experience. That's where some of the things start. So even in training, the ultra running started becoming a significant part of my life. And then a few years ago, I kind of had this, like, wow, wouldn't it be really cool to pull off one of these 100 milers? And so I actually put it on my goals for, I set it as a three year goal. The goal was actually for 2023.
Brian Mininger00:07:31 - 00:08:40
And last year, I did, I think, six races that were marathon distance, one marathon and five ultras. And at the end of that, I did 150 miler, did another one this spring, and at the end of that, I was like, you know what? I think within ten months, I can be ready for 100 miles. And so I registered for this race about a year ago and said, okay, there it is, there's line in the sand, and started preparing. So that's kind of what got me to this point. Sure, the takeaways as I got into the event are different, but maybe I'll start with some training. Takeaways is that sometimes when you commit to something, it starts taking more than you realized. When I said, like, hey, I think I want to accomplish 100 miles, I didn't really understand what that meant or what that took. And as I started down the journey and I continued to train, I started realizing how hard this was.
Brian Mininger00:08:41 - 00:09:29
And there were certainly points in my training journey, where it felt absolutely impossible. One of those points was I felt like I couldn't mentally get past the fact that I had only ever run 50 miles and I was going to try to do 100, which was double. So all of the other distance step ups that I had done had been maybe 20 or 30% at most from what I had done previously. This was like, hey, we're taking the hardest thing I've ever done and we're going to double it. It was pretty overwhelming to me. And so I actually attempted to do it in training over the summer, basically create my own race. And I didn't make it. I only made it 50 miles, which only.
Brian Mininger00:09:29 - 00:10:13
And I started having some pain issues in my foot. But I knew that at that point, if I injured myself, I was never going to complete the race. And so I had to shut it down at that point. And then there wasn't time to try again. And so I had to just know that the race was going to be my first attempt. I didn't want it to be my first attempt, but it was. And so in that stretch, there was a whole lot of doubt about, is this even possible? And that is the one thing about ultra racing is that there's a high percentage of people that don't complete the races. Like in the race, I ran almost 30%, 30.
Brian Mininger00:10:13 - 00:10:42
Some percent of the starting field did not finish. And so, you know that that's very possible, that just teeing up to the line doesn't guarantee a finish. So it's not just about time. It's like, am I going to beat my pr from the last time? It's like, can I even do this period at any time? There was a lot of mental mind stuff that I had to battle leading up.
Wayne Herring00:10:43 - 00:11:07
So the race was the grindstone 100, right in the mountains of southwest Virginia, which have gone to Virginia Tech. I've hunted on some of those ridges and been up and down them. They're kind of no joke. And anybody who's been on skyline Drive or in Shenandoah National park knows some of the topography down towards your area. So the course was not just 100 miles flat on the rail trail or.
Brian Mininger00:11:07 - 00:11:50
Something either, was it correct? No. This is 23,000ft of gain over 100 miles, which is a little hard to maybe if you're not familiar, but that's a lot. It was an out and back course and we climbed four mountains and we did it out and we did it back. So we climbed eight times where we descended and then climbed. And sections of the trail were so rocky, that it didn't matter whether you were going up or down. Running was very difficult and early in the race. Another thing about it, race starts at 06:00 p.m. On Friday.
Brian Mininger00:11:50 - 00:12:37
So you immediately go into the night. So it took me just under 29 hours. So that was missing a complete night's night of sleep. I was into 11:00, essentially the second night when I finally finished. So you've got difficult terrain footing. You've got running at night, you've got elevation, you've got the distance, you've got lack of sleep. There's a lot of compounding challenges that go into things. One of the things that I've seen is that as the mileage of races double the finishing times, triple.
Brian Mininger00:12:38 - 00:13:02
Sure, there's longer races, but 200 miles races, the finishing times are about triple. 100 miles races. For me, the finishing time for 100 miles was about triple my 50 miles time. So the distance has a compounding effect on how long it takes.
Wayne Herring00:13:03 - 00:14:03
Yeah, that makes sense to me. And the longest I've done is 31 miles. And that sounds about right, from 15 to 31. And I'm not sure I want to do 50 or 60. That's for another time. But anyway, hey, what calls to me, Brian, is I'd like to pause a little bit on the run stuff and actually go to business and life, because there's so many, I'm making connections in my mind. But I also know you quite well, and I think it would help listeners to hear some of your business journey. So could you tell us a bit of the story of when you first went from and you talked about being an employee and then a leader, and then you crossed over into entrepreneur world? Can you tell us about when you first had the call and started on your entrepreneur journey and what some of that looked like as you built your business?
Brian Mininger00:14:04 - 00:14:58
It's a long story. I'll try not to take too much of it, but I think some of the key things are I actually thought I would be a pastor, and so that's the journey that I started on in school. I got married young and needed to support my family. So through some family things, I had carpentry skills a little bit. So that's what I started into to support my family. The guy I was working for went to retire, and so I kind of decided to start my own thing, which actually grew fairly quickly. And in the process, I found a passion for business that I didn't know I had. But I was a bible college graduate, not a business graduate, and so I had to just kind of voraciously learn everything I could, wherever I could.
Brian Mininger00:14:58 - 00:15:55
And thankfully, it was the early stages of the Internet age, and stuff was out there and books were out there. And so I took workshops and I participated in trade associations and chamber of commerce, and I talked to other business owners and basically did everything I could to try to learn. And we were having some success. I had some struggles and learning curve, but we were growing and we were doing well. And then I made some risky moves, thinking that the boom of the late 2000s would last forever. And everybody knows what happened in eight, nine, and construction took a massive hit. But furniture was even worse. And I had parlayed our construction company into the launch of a furniture store, which we opened in seven, and basically just in time to lose our shirts on everything we had done.
Brian Mininger00:15:55 - 00:16:35
We didn't even get it open early enough to make any money on it, and we were not able to weather it. And so we ended up in corporate and personal bankruptcy in nine and kind of launched what I would call kind of a dark season. I did some freelance stuff. I tried to kind of get back on my feet. I worked for some other companies. Wore off construction kind of left that arena for a while. Was also a bivocational pastor during this season, church planning pastor. So that kind of compounded a lot of things, too.
Brian Mininger00:16:35 - 00:17:39
But anyway, all that journey kind of led then to Victoria starting the company that we now run as a subcontracted company to the commercial firm that I was working for about six, seven years ago. And it was a side hustle, in full disclosure. And then my job got unstable and we decided we'd better take my licenses and get licenses for the company and have a backup plan. And when that happened, about six months later, I came over and we started doing construction. And that was about seven years ago. Today we have somewhere around 35 employees. We've bought a 25,000 square foot facility that is our shop and our headquarters of operations. We've kind of been through a few evolutions about what our products and services are, but for basically the last five years, we have found a niche in the outdoor living space.
Brian Mininger00:17:39 - 00:18:41
And so we basically help people create spaces at their homes that help them get outdoors more. And so we want to be for the home what Patagonia and ll bean are for adventuring. We build spaces, we furnish them, we design them. And so decks, patios, pergolas, outdoor kitchens, fire pits, furniture, landscaping, whatever it takes to create spaces that allow people to get outdoors in daily life. And so I'm an outdoors person that's part of why ultra running draws me. And so that's part of how we found this niche, is we just like, let's zero down on what we really enjoy. I mean, I'm licensed to build an apartment building if I want, I've done it and so forth, but we just decided to try to find the niche that we really enjoyed. And so Victoria and I have been building that company for the last six, seven.
Brian Mininger00:18:42 - 00:19:21
Um, anyway, so that's some of the business journey. What I will say that, as it kind of relates to the ultra running, is I am, by personality, an energetic starter. I can blast off. If you were to compare me to a runner, I'm a sprinter, not an endurance guy. I can put a lot of muscle before something's new. I've had a hard time through the years playing the long game with things. I go out too fast, I get burnout, I don't manage my energy well. And then I get discouraged and depressed when things aren't moving as quickly as I like.
Brian Mininger00:19:21 - 00:20:18
And so that's one of the things that has. Why I've stuck with an endurance sport is because it's teaching me things that are not intuitive to me. So, for example, when I first started running, my approach was to every training thing was just run hard, run as hard as I could go, every single time. I was jacking my heart rate up to, like, 175, and I completely plateaued. I was sore, I couldn't go any further, I wasn't getting any faster, so forth. And then I learned about heart rate, restricted training, and alternating training, and doing hard workouts and slow workouts. And so I started monitoring heart rate and so forth, and started slowing down, which is completely foreign to my mindset. I'm like, go big, go home.
Brian Mininger00:20:18 - 00:21:11
No pain, no gain. And yet, that's what it took. And in ultra running, you don't finish a race without that mindset. And so that's where most of my learning is. As I look at what's written in my journal, it continues to be, what are the things that help me go long? And as I've reflected on it, as much as I know I can bring value by being a starter and an energetic starter. Most things in life that matter, that are worth having are not a short game. They are a long game. Husband, father, my physical health, building a business that lasts, being a friend.
Brian Mininger00:21:11 - 00:22:01
None of these things are short game. And so if I want to succeed at the things that matter, I've got to learn how to play a long game. And so, for me, some people that may come much more naturally for me. It did not. And so that's part of where the value of this, and I would suspect if I'm talking to a group of entrepreneurs, there's a whole lot of you out there that are just like me anyway, because we're the ones that initiate things and get things done. And so we got to continue to be initiators. But if we want what we create to have any lasting value, we've either got to learn to hand it off or learn to play a long game. And I'm not sitting here saying what anyone should or shouldn't do, but I'm in a place, I don't want to hand it off.
Brian Mininger00:22:01 - 00:22:03
I want to play the long game. So I'm trying to learn.
Wayne Herring00:22:04 - 00:22:37
You mentioned Victoria and that Victoria started this business, and now you work together. And so just in terms of helping listeners know you a little bit better, you and Victoria work together today. What's that like, working together? And then also, you mentioned family. So you're a family guy and an intentional dad and have children, and you two have endured through challenging times. You just brought that up with the business having been in a bad place and bankruptcy and things. Tell us about how you and Victoria work together and about your family.
Brian Mininger00:22:37 - 00:23:17
That's a whole other podcast. But anyway, it is a question we get a lot. So we've worked together in different ways through the years. She has always worked in our companies or initiatives, but it has primarily been me because we have four daughters, and so they were young, they were all close together in age, and so Victoria's time capacity was limited. Today, all four are kind of out of the house or transitioning out. So two of them are married. So I have two son in laws, two are in college. So Victoria has a lot more time the last few years than she's had in the past.
Brian Mininger00:23:17 - 00:23:57
So this has really been the first stretch where we have worked together full time is in this company. It has been a learning experience. So when I was kind of the lead and she was filling in more part time support roles, bookkeeping, so forth, it was a very different dynamic at work. Whereas for the last five years, we've been both members of the leadership team, we've led the company at some level together. We've had different roles. We've had staff members that relate to us. I've kind of run the construction and sales side of things. She's run the administrative team and a lot of the other.
Brian Mininger00:23:59 - 00:24:44
So we've had to learn a new way and a new season of finding each other's roles and so forth. We're kind of in a season now where she's exploring some other career things that she's not been able to do before. And I'm more responsible for the day to day here, but we're both involved in decision making and leadership and so forth, along with two other members of our team now. So it's not just two of us, but she owns the company. I work for her. That is the way it was set up originally. We have not changed that anyway. But, yeah, that's a little bit about my family and my kids.
Brian Mininger00:24:44 - 00:25:20
And actually back to the whole health thing, that was actually one of my biggest deficiencies that I was really struggling with is that basically, by the time I got done with work every day because of schedule, work went first. When I got home, I had nothing left for my kids. I mean, I'm plopping in a chair and I can't hardly get out for the evening. And my kids are middle school, whatever, they're wanting to do stuff and play and have fun, and I just got tired of saying, no, I'm sorry, I can't do anyway. That answer the question.
Wayne Herring00:25:20 - 00:25:48
It does. And one thing worth noting is that Victoria is an author and has written a book. So if anybody's curious more about her story, they can find Victoria Mininger. And she writes great emails and both from the company. And I know in social media she's been doing more. I saw a picture of the two of you on McAfee Knob on the appalachian trail the other day, and some inspiring words for people going through difficult times.
Brian Mininger00:25:49 - 00:26:40
Yeah, and the other piece of that that I guess I didn't say, know, we've definitely had our ups and downs. We've definitely had to climb some mountains. And one of those was Victoria went through a couple years of debilitating depression to the point where she could not function. And I had to take care of the kids and everything else. And so that's what she writes about in her book, daring to fight. And as her journey back out of that, so even the fact that she's functioning at the level of leadership that she is today is nothing short of a miracle, as far as I'm concerned. And I had a role to play. My unhealth and my physical body also corresponded to a lot of unhealth, emotionally and relationally.
Brian Mininger00:26:40 - 00:27:19
That took its toll on those closest to me, in particular, Victoria. And so we've had to walk that journey of. For me, I've had to walk the journey of recognizing the role I played so that I can grow and change from it without beating myself up and living in that. And at the same time, she has had to learn how to manage her mental health and life and so forth so that she can be healthy, too. We've definitely had some mountains that we've had to climb, for sure.
Wayne Herring00:27:20 - 00:27:22
And thanks for talking about that in.
Brian Mininger00:27:22 - 00:27:24
A very vulnerable way.
Wayne Herring00:27:24 - 00:28:13
You dropped into it, and we're open about it. And I love the book. Victoria gave me a copy the last time that I was there visiting with you all, and the book was helpful for me. I read it in my morning reflection time and journaled about multiple questions that she asked in there. And I wouldn't have said that I wouldn't have identified as being depressed. And I have no idea whether that it's clinical depression or not, but I know I identify with a whole lot of what she was talking about. And there were several exercises in there that I wrote about and journaled about that helped me make mental shifts. So it is something that people should pick a copy of it up if they benefit from your story to then add Victoria's from the other side.
Wayne Herring00:28:13 - 00:29:03
We don't often get to see that in this way, where I could hear you speak authentically about business and the race and then also get to hear it through Victoria. That's a gift to be able to read it, the two of you together, because Catherine and I certainly have climbed mountains. We just celebrated our 20th wedding anniversary, and it has not been all like, hats and horns and smiling faces on Facebook. Right. It's been a lot of work, like an endurance race and being in business and being somebody who has lots of ideas and starts quick. It's natural that sometimes we cause vibrations to the rest of our family. That requires us to do some work to get past it. So, yeah, thanks for sharing.
Wayne Herring00:29:03 - 00:29:29
And so now we know a bit more about Bear Creek outdoor living and how you got to here and what you're building, and you were talking about your training. I think it really helps tie the story together to know more about you in that way. So, for sure, tell us more about you were talking about training and commitment, and maybe there's more about that and more lessons in the back of your journal there. Or maybe it's the transition of the race itself.
Brian Mininger00:29:30 - 00:30:23
Yeah. Before I go there, I will kind of recognize one thing is that I have intentionally brought up two subjects that we don't like to talk about. One is bankruptcy and one is depression. And part of the reason that I have trained myself to use those words is because when I do, there's always somebody listening that is suffering in silence. And I've been the person suffering in silence. I've been the person that was suffering through the bankruptcy, and very few people knew what was going on. I've also been the person that was suffering through having a wife who had basically vanished. And this person that was there was not my wife anymore, and I had no idea if she was ever coming back.
Brian Mininger00:30:26 - 00:31:32
And yet very few people knew. Even then, we tried to let people in that were close to us, but it's not things that we're very good at talking about. And so, anyway, so I say that to say that if you're facing some of that stuff and you need somebody to talk to, I'm a construction guy. I answer my cell phone. So I'm not one of these online guys that's used to screening everything under the sun. So if wayne wants to put my cell phone in here, you can put it in here and you can call me, but I'm more than willing to try to encourage or help whatever I can. So as we kind of transition to the race, I'll kind of go back to what I hinted at in the beginning, of kind of how overwhelming this thing became. As I got close mentally, I knew I was as prepared as I'd ever been to tackle it training wise, and yet I still wasn't sure if I could do it.
Brian Mininger00:31:33 - 00:32:20
The thing was that the distance was what was so overwhelming to me. Like, I knew I could climb mountains, I knew I could do rocky trails. I even knew I could go through the night because I did all that in training, but I was like, can I put all those together and can I go this far? Somewhere in there. I don't know if I heard this from another runner or I just kind of came to this realization that I had to just go aid station to aid station, and I had to stay in the moment. I could not think about 100 miles. I just flat out couldn't. If I did, I would give up. And so, I'll be honest, I literally did not start thinking about the finish line until the last half mile.
Brian Mininger00:32:21 - 00:32:57
The only point before that was when I got to the last aid station, and I'd been kind of going aid station to aid station as a goal, and aid stations were six to 9 miles apart. So as I slowed down, those were three to 4 hours. Even there, those were long segments. When I left an aid station, it was like, it's going to be a while till you get to the next one. Just settle in and go. So when I got to the last aid station, I realized like, okay, next one is finished. But then I looked down like, it's 5 miles. It's probably going to take me an hour and a half to 2 hours at where I'm going right now.
Brian Mininger00:32:57 - 00:33:37
Going to be a while to settle in and start moving. I had to stay super present. And that became the beauty of it. It's what made it possible. It's what made some of the moments amazing. There was a point on the first night, I don't know, somewhere around mile 15 or so. So it was still early in the race, so I was holding back, I wasn't pushing. I ended up on the trail by myself for maybe an hour or two.
Brian Mininger00:33:37 - 00:34:23
And it was a pretty long descent and not too difficult terrain. And I was just kind of flowing and it was quiet, well, the sounds of the woods. And there was just a peace that descended into that place. And for me, I'm a man of faith. I believe it was the peace of God that just settled into that space. But it went so deep that I was feeling that a week later, literally, I could still feel that stillness in my soul. That kind of happened as the noise in my head and everything just kind of settled and melted away. That's the number one thing that I wrote down, is focus on the moment.
Brian Mininger00:34:23 - 00:35:10
And so then later in the race, legs were tired, everything hurt. I had huge blisters on the heels of my feet that developed somewhere around mile 75. When I got done, that was the biggest reason I couldn't hardly walk, was the blisters on my feet and I had gone 25 miles on them. But I remember we were climbing a long grade and I had a pacer with me. So pacers are allowed in ultras. Basically somebody that just runs with you somewhat for safety. You don't have to have them, but I knew I was going to need one. And we were going up this long grade and I've got my poles and I'm hiking away and I looked up to my left and I saw this mountain just towering over me.
Brian Mininger00:35:10 - 00:36:14
And the guy that's going with me, he knew the course and I said, are we going up there? And he kind of, yeah. And all I could think is, don't look, head back down 10ft in front of you. And that's basically what I found. I couldn't look straight down because I couldn't judge what was happening, but I couldn't even look 100 yards up the trail because the climb would just get too much. I had to look about 1015ft in front of me, and then I could see progress, because if I looked 100 yards up the trail, it didn't look like I was moving. I could see progress and yet I could see in front of me a little bit. And so sometimes I think, as a visionary, I think I've thought that being in the present and having a goal and direction were somehow mutually exclusive. Like that I had to live in the future to be able to be visionary and to be goal oriented and to accomplish anything great.
Brian Mininger00:36:14 - 00:36:45
And I think in this race, I found, like, I don't. The goal was set. The goal told me where to go, the goal told me of the course, and that was set as a choice. But once I got into it, the only thing I needed to do was take the next step. I didn't really have to think about the goal because I'd marked the course. That was an exercise. I didn't mark the course, they marked the course, but I chose a course, marked it. And so then there were points where I needed to check and see.
Brian Mininger00:36:45 - 00:37:39
If the course had not been marked, I would have needed to stop at points and check my bearings. But throughout the weeks since, that has been really helpful for me. It's like, okay, am I checking my course, setting my goal? If not, get back to the present. Like, get dog on it, get back to the present and just focus on the next step. Don't even worry about tomorrow, don't worry about the next day. And it has really helped me from just a mental peace standpoint. I realized that I was worrying about the next three days almost never ending. And then, because I can see things forward that a lot of people don't see, I can see potential pitfalls, I can see potential challenges.
Brian Mininger00:37:39 - 00:37:53
I can see things we need to accomplish, even months out. And I'd find myself worrying about those things. And so that's probably my number one takeaway. I mean, I wrote five or six things down here, but that's the big one for me.
Wayne Herring00:37:53 - 00:39:04
It's interesting, when I was running the half marathon and I was thinking about you and that you had finished this and thinking about having this conversation with you, one of the things that went through my mind was during that race, which was fairly far from me, was that I have a running watch on that tracks distance. But I realized I don't look at it. I'm not obsessing about it. I'm not looking at it. I do hear it beep when it goes past the miles, I kind of hear it beep, but I'm not looking and thinking all the time about where the destination is and how far ahead it is until like you said, actually in that particular situation, there was a grade you topped out on and then it was downhill to the end. Then I did think about it and I knew that it was coming up. We do look long in business. It's okay to think about a three to five year vision or even what does a 25 year life well lived look like? But knowing that we can't see the end with any absolute certainty.
Wayne Herring00:39:04 - 00:39:08
But yeah, then it's always about the next step. So I like the way.
Brian Mininger00:39:08 - 00:39:52
Right. We only function in the present. The future has bearing on our direction, but we can't control any of it. All we can do is control the moment. And so all of our progress toward that goal happens in the moment. And the moment is constantly changing on the trail. One of the things that people ask me before a race, what is your pace going to be? And I've learned to tell them, if I've never run the race before, I have no earthly idea because there'll be sections where I can go really fast, and there's going to be sections where I can go really slow and I don't even know when they're coming. And sometimes it's 100 yards.
Brian Mininger00:39:52 - 00:40:40
And so I literally have to take the trail as it comes. And so if it's rocky and I'm climbing, I slow down and I use my poles. And if it happens to open up on a nice gradual descent with clear, no rocks, man, I open it up and I go. But you're just responding to what's there. So your pace is very much so. Your direction is sort of set by the vision, but your pace is adjusted in the moment because you don't know what the obstacles are going to be. You can set a goal for your business, you can set a financial goal, you can set a sales goal, whatever, but you don't know what the trail is going to be, so to speak.
Wayne Herring00:40:40 - 00:40:54
What do you think it looks like? I wrote my question down earlier, and now you're bringing it up. What does it look like to be super present? For most people who would be listening to this in business life, how would you help them understand what this being.
Brian Mininger00:40:54 - 00:40:57
Super present, what might that look like.
Wayne Herring00:40:57 - 00:41:07
For a business owner? Even if you think about yourself like five, eight years ago, before you had this understanding, what would super present look like?
Brian Mininger00:41:07 - 00:42:22
I mean, I can tell you what it looks like a little bit for me right now, and this was not a major shift from some of my habits, but it's become an intentional thought process. I look at my week over the weekend, basically, or beginning of Monday. I have a default schedule that kind of populates, but I look at each week, and so I kind of plan out what I think the key things are. I know the big picture, what I got to accomplish in a week. So then each day I'm looking at it in advance and in my reflection, quiet prayer time, I'm kind of laying it out there before the Lord and saying, okay, this is what I got is this right? Like, these are number one things I'm supposed to focus on today. And if that's the case, then absolutely nothing else matters at all unless a curveball comes my way and I need to respond to it. But otherwise, the only thing that matters today is today. And there's a verse in Ephesians that says that God has prepared us for good or has created us for good works that he has prepared in advance for us to do today.
Brian Mininger00:42:23 - 00:43:34
One of the inherent truths in that statement is that there's also things he has not prepared for today. What I've kind of been doing is the same reminder that I was giving myself in the race of take the next step. Look at the trail, look at where you are, refocus where you are. It's kind of the same thing I found myself doing throughout my days is like, okay, right now I'm in this meeting with these people working on this thing. Forget the dangle cell phone and whoever else might call or whatever might be going on, whatever emails I haven't responded to or whatever. None of that matters right now because right now the only thing I'm doing is doing this initiative, whatever this meeting is about or whatever. It's sort of becoming part of my mental exercise as I go throughout my day. I probably would be add if I were 23 years old.
Brian Mininger00:43:34 - 00:44:07
You know what I mean? Like, I grew up in a day and time when none of us knew what 80 was. But yeah, literally, I can walk into my office, headed to my computer to look for something, and ten minutes later, I never got there and I am somewhere else. And all of a sudden I realize, like, what did I even sit down here for? Really focusing on present and focus is something that I have to consciously do.
Wayne Herring00:44:08 - 00:44:11
I heard you'd say you cultivate a.
Brian Mininger00:44:11 - 00:44:15
Practice of listening for wisdom with a.
Wayne Herring00:44:15 - 00:44:33
Capital w, voice of God. Cultivate a habit of listening and quieting thoughts. And I also hear that you are aware of the thinker or my thoughts, like, you've made that where you see your own thoughts going on, you're aware of your own thoughts going on as well.
Brian Mininger00:44:34 - 00:44:43
Yeah, I think my thoughts like to hijack the moment, so I have to be mindful of that.
Wayne Herring00:44:43 - 00:44:47
So that was lesson one. What was lesson two?
Brian Mininger00:44:47 - 00:45:27
All right, so what I wrote here is, over the miles, little things matter. So little things that maybe don't matter in the short term, matter in the long term. And so I'll give an example. I went out with trail shoes that were about half a size too small because I switched manufacturer shoes about a month, month and a half ago. When you switch shoes, it's a little hard to get them sized, right? And once they broke in, I knew they weren't quite right. So when I bought a road shoe from the same manufacturer, I bought a half a size bigger. It was perfect. But I'd been running in them and I thought it was okay.
Brian Mininger00:45:28 - 00:46:42
And so I went out with them, and I was okay for 75 miles. And somewhere about there I realized, like, oh, my word, my toe is pounding the front of this shoe. And so we changed shoes at mile 80, got to the aid station. When I got done and peeled my socks off, I had destroyed my big toenail because of a shoe that was not quite big enough. And the fact that I had failed to trim the toenail right before the race, two very little things had resulted in me destroying my toe, so to speak. I think those parallels are all so oftentimes we have staff members, for example, and there's something not quite right in the relationship or whatever, and we just think, like, it'll work itself out, it'll go away. When we're playing the long game, we have to pay more attention to the little things because they multiply, they add up little wastes in the way we do. Things become big things.
Brian Mininger00:46:42 - 00:47:23
We know that from finances. You look at it and say, well, this little expenditure isn't a big deal, but you multiply. And I've seen that in my company as it's gotten bigger things, that we're going to spend $45,000 in fuel this year. So just to put some things in perspective. So when the gas went up, I didn't have control over it, but when the gas went up, it had huge impact on us. As you go longer, as you go further, whatever it is, just know that some of the little things that don't matter early on are going to matter.
Wayne Herring00:47:23 - 00:48:04
So one of the things that I like to pull out of episodes like this is practical journaling exercises that business builders can go through and with that one, if we were to just sit and write down what are the little things that might matter? And you gave some good examples there. $30 a month subscriptions, driving twice, backtracking for something and it burns more gas. And we often know those things. We hear the small voice when we're quiet, but we don't really make a list and it's kind of a pain to deal with it. So thank you for that. Number three.
Brian Mininger00:48:04 - 00:48:42
All right, here's number three. Slow progress is progress. Keep moving forward, even slowly, you can go far. To give a little more understanding about ultra running is I did not run for 100 miles. Most people mistakingly think that even the elite runners probably did not run this entire 100 miles. Now, they ran a lot more of it than I did, but the key to finishing was continuing to move forward. And so I finished. To give perspective, 187 started, 135 finished.
Brian Mininger00:48:42 - 00:49:20
I finished 59th. So I was top third of this race. And I probably hiked and walked at least 40, 50% of this event. And to even put in perspective, it's 50 miles out, 50 miles back. The way out was a net ascent because we turned around at a high point. The net return was a net descent. There were two little spurs up mountains that we didn't do on the return trip. It took me 13 hours on the way out.
Brian Mininger00:49:20 - 00:49:58
It took me 16 on the way back. So I was slowing down significantly. Pretty much the last 20 miles I hiked. For the most part. There were a couple of stretches in there where on some downhills where I was able to get moving. But I mean, at that point my quads were busted up so bad, I couldn't hardly run downhill any more than I could anything else. So what got to the end was just forward progress. And sometimes that's the same way in business.
Brian Mininger00:49:58 - 00:50:28
It's like you just got to trust that even slow progress is progress. And sometimes I think we get discouraged by slow progress and we quit. We don't get, um, anyway. But it is progress, even if it doesn't feel like, mean. There were points. Just to give you some perspective as how slow I got is in the last section, Victoria did the last 5 miles with me. We got up on a gravel road that was wide, so we were side by side. It was easy.
Brian Mininger00:50:28 - 00:50:48
So I was like, okay, I'm going to run for a little bit. I start shuffling my feet and I look over and Victoria is walking as fast as I am. Yeah, you get to those points, but it's still progress. And without that, you don't accomplish anything. Amazing.
Wayne Herring00:50:50 - 00:50:51
It was awesome. You finished it together.
Brian Mininger00:50:52 - 00:50:53
All right, that's number three.
Wayne Herring00:50:53 - 00:50:57
I remember that one. I'll remember. Brian says, slow progress is progress.
Brian Mininger00:50:57 - 00:52:27
Great. All right, number four, pay attention to fueling. So the joke in ultra running is that ultra running is actually an eating contest over the miles because you are burning so much that fueling is hard, and it's hard because your body doesn't want to digest it. You've got to consume so much, you don't sometimes feel like it. Your stomach can get upset from the exercise, and then you end up with low fuel, low energy. And so the takeaway for me is that if I'm going to do something, endurance, and I'm going to be putting out, what am I putting in? So if I'm burning up the energy, so to speak, running my business, what am I doing to refuel, to rest, to recoup, to build my spirit and even physical fueling, I have become a way better business person because I am physically strong right now. I can handle the day. I can go into a meeting at 330 in the afternoon and be game on because I am fueling my body, right? My body is strong.
Brian Mininger00:52:27 - 00:53:00
And we don't talk about this in business much, but you look at the top executives and business leaders, and you're hard pressed to find somebody that does not take care of their physical health and does not pay attention to their fuel. I mean, there may be a few, but there are the baby roots of the world. But I can tell you Aaron judge fuels religiously, and Ruth was the. So anyway, well, and I think even.
Wayne Herring00:53:00 - 00:53:21
If you could build a successful business and not be fueling, not taking care of body, mind and spirit, you could be in the middle of that and not realize how much better you could feel if you did take care of body, mind and spirit. So you could have whatever the world considers to be conventional success and lots of joy and feel good.
Brian Mininger00:53:21 - 00:54:40
Yeah. And the thing if you look at, just take sports for a little bit, but it's true in other domains, is the greater the intensity of the engagement, the greater the amount of rest and prep for it. So, like 100 meters sprinter at the Olympics spends how much time resting, preparing their body for just tiny little game on a speaker might spend all day putting in, taking care of for an hour on stage, whatever. And so as the demands on us go up, the intensity of the quality of what our engagement needs to be, there needs to be a corresponding fueling. For example, I think it was somewhere around 12,000 calories that I burned in this thing, according to my watch. So to do the intense performance took an intense fueling. And I think sometimes we don't think about that. We just think about the performance.
Brian Mininger00:54:40 - 00:55:16
We don't think about the fueling that it takes to support the performance, whatever the performance is. I'll give an example of this in my business is that every few months, we do an all team event, and I'll have everybody here and I help lead that. There's things I got to do, I got to speak. I got to be game on. I got to be able to handle all kinds of situations. I got to be relationally connecting with people, and it's a lot of people, and it's multiplied through a lot of people. It's not just four or five anymore. It's 35.
Brian Mininger00:55:16 - 00:55:56
And if I'm game off and everybody walks away, like, man, what's his problem? He doesn't really care about me. The ripple effect in our company could be massive. And so I've stopped running meetings up to that thing. Oftentimes, I'll go out for a two hour run before that meeting, because for me, that's my refuel. But I'm like, okay, I got to be game on for this hour and a half. So the rest of the day, I'm blocking it out. I am not like I used to just run through the day. I'd fill the day like anything else, and then I'd go into that meeting, and I was not ready.
Brian Mininger00:55:56 - 00:56:03
There were times I responded poorly to something that happened in the meeting. So that's an example of it.
Wayne Herring00:56:03 - 00:56:22
Well, it's also an example of how you're creating the opportunity to refuel and connect for your team. And that's not cheap to bring everybody in for that period of time. And it could feel like you really ought to be working and grinding and grinding more, but you're even giving them a reset and helping them. So that great example.
Brian Mininger00:56:22 - 00:56:54
And what's number five? Number five is, we talked about this, actually, earlier. The peace in the moment, rest in it, feeling it, experience it. There are moments of peace. It will live in them. And so, yeah, that peace, that just sometimes it's unexpected. I wasn't expecting it. I wasn't necessarily looking for it. But in every long game or things, there are highs and there are lows.
Brian Mininger00:56:54 - 00:57:28
There's points where you're grinding up the mountain, and there's points where you're kind of on the mountaintop. Just like the turnaround, for example, was on a mountain that I got to right about sunrise, I could see 360 degrees and I'd gone 50 miles. But, man, it was a surreal moment. And so find those moments and just soak them in because you're going to need it when you're climbing the next mountain. Maybe it factors into fueling, but yeah, find those moments.
Wayne Herring00:57:28 - 00:57:40
That was incredible. You said there are moments of peace, if we will live into them. You gave me chills when you said that.
Brian Mininger00:57:40 - 00:57:57
If we'll pay attention. See, this comes back to being in the present up on that mountain, 360 degree sunrise mountain into West Virginia and sunrise and everything. If I'm thinking about the climb up the next mountain that I got to go to, I don't enjoy that sunrise one bit.
Wayne Herring00:57:58 - 00:58:00
Yeah, that was a big gift for me.
Brian Mininger00:58:00 - 00:58:01
All right.
Wayne Herring00:58:01 - 00:58:02
So thank you for that.
Brian Mininger00:58:02 - 00:58:04
Okay, I got one more.
Wayne Herring00:58:05 - 00:58:05
Awesome.
Brian Mininger00:58:05 - 00:58:43
You can't do this alone. It looks like a solo accomplishment. But Victoria was up a good chunk of the night driving other places, hauling gear. I had a pacer with me for over 30 miles plus. Victoria. I trained with people in advance of the event. I talked to other runners who had done this before. I've had health professionals that have helped me with fueling and training.
Brian Mininger00:58:47 - 00:59:32
There's just no way you do this by yourself. I've got maybe a more detailed story about that from one of my other events. I've actually shared it. It's about a 20 minutes presentation illustration I've done a few times, but about a race where I almost quit. But the bottom line is it takes a lot of people to get through something like this. And so same is true in any endurance thing in life. You may be the one carrying the ball. That may be true, but there's other people that you need along with it.
Wayne Herring00:59:32 - 00:59:55
That's, that's my to. You're not making that last item about you. But Brian Midninger, those people wouldn't have shown up for you in that way if you also didn't spend a life of serving others and pouring into them and being there for all of them, too. So that's really cool.
Brian Mininger00:59:55 - 01:00:40
Yeah. It might still be emotional for me. I came across the finish line and two of my girls are there, one with her husband, one with her significant other. My parents are there. My pacer is there. Victoria's beside me. And my other two girls who couldn't be there are on FaceTime with my daughter's phone. When I got back later and saw all the social, I mean, I'm not on social media a whole lot, so Victoria was the one sharing and posting.
Brian Mininger01:00:40 - 01:01:46
Know, when I got back and saw all the comments and the engagement and the people cheering me on, the text messages that I got, the people that. It was pretty overwhelming. I'm incredibly grateful. When I'm running, I reflect on what it was like eight years ago when I couldn't get out of chair and I didn't feel healthy and strong. Three years ago, for example, I went with some guys from church and we went backpacking in Glacier National park. And one night we were camping near a climb up to a fire tower that one of the rangers told us was the best view in the park. People don't ever go up there. Me and another guy are like, okay, we're going to scale that tomorrow morning for sunrise.
Brian Mininger01:01:46 - 01:02:22
And me and him were the only ones physically up to the challenge. And it was one of the coolest moments I've ever had in my life being up there. I'm just extremely grateful that I'm able to do some of the things that I do today. It's by a lot of other people. It's by God's grace. It's any number of things. I've been really blessed.
Wayne Herring01:02:23 - 01:03:25
Yeah. And when Victoria was sharing about you doing the 100 miles race and all the people who had made comments, certainly you and your journey was an inspiration for the people reading it and a gift to people reading it. And the tie in here for the people listening is the journey that each person is on. Who would want to listen to this story? Who's a business builder who is creating something in their community, no matter what stage they're at, from dream to, I don't know, $100 million or whatever it is, they are an inspiration and can be an inspiration for those around them and show the way for other people that hard things are possible. So thanks so much for coming and sharing. And you prepared and created a nice list of six things for us. I'm really grateful, Brian.
Brian Mininger01:03:26 - 01:03:29
I actually did not prepare a list of six things for you.
Wayne Herring01:03:29 - 01:03:31
Oh, you got it.
Brian Mininger01:03:31 - 01:03:34
I wrote this in my journal two days after the race.
Wayne Herring01:03:34 - 01:03:36
Oh, nice. Wonderful.
Brian Mininger01:03:36 - 01:03:51
I knew there were takeaways, or maybe it was five days after the race, but I knew I needed to write these things down. And so then when you kind of sent me, hey, this is what we need somewhat we're talking about. I'm like, well, I actually have it.
Wayne Herring01:03:51 - 01:03:52
I got it.
Brian Mininger01:03:52 - 01:03:53
I wrote it for myself.
Wayne Herring01:03:55 - 01:04:35
And that's a good lesson for all of us, is that you're reflective and you're journaling and seeing what it means. So thanks for that piece, too. And the part about depression and bankruptcy. And I'll share about my alcoholism for that same reason, because somebody somewhere might need to hear it. And I'm like, you always willing for those places that have been dark for me to help somebody else walk out of it, because others help me on the journey. So thanks for that, too. How can people follow along with your journey, connect with you? And is there anything that you'd like to share with them about what you're up to at Bear Creek?
Brian Mininger01:04:36 - 01:05:19
Yes. I think what we're doing here is pretty cool. I love being a part of this team and the stuff that we get to do. I am a craftsman by nature. Like, I love to create, and so it's cool to see our team creating the things that we do. I'm much more of a teacher today than the active craftsman, but know I have a team that does social media since I'm not so good at it anymore. But you can definitely find Bear Creek outdoor living on Instagram and Facebook and follow along there. Victoria does a much better job with that.
Brian Mininger01:05:19 - 01:06:04
As you mentioned earlier, she's a writer and so forth, so you can find her@victoriaminninger.com and her book, daring to fight, you can find in Amazon. So that'll give you more about our story as it relates. Wayne, you're more than welcome to put my email and so forth in here for those that want to connect. But, yeah, that's probably the best way I would tell you, like, yeah, connect on Twitter, Instagram, or Facebook, but you wouldn't get anything. So there's no point. I mean, if you want to connect with my personal profiles, go right ahead. But I got.
Wayne Herring01:06:07 - 01:06:16
The emails that I think Victoria does. A lot of those that have things like, here's how you do this awesome s'more kit. And, oh, by the way, okay, no.
Brian Mininger01:06:16 - 01:07:03
Those come from Bear Creek Outdoor living. So if you go to Bearcreek Co. You can find, I think it's under the blog tab. You'll find our monthly newsletters and there's a link where you can join that list. But yeah, my team does an awesome job of putting together just some great stuff for living outdoors. We're champions of it. We believe that the amount of time that our culture has shifted indoors is to the detriment of our personal lives, our souls, and our relationships. We talk about s'mores and food and entertaining and cool gadgets and fire pits and all the stuff that, great things that we get to do to get outside.
Brian Mininger01:07:03 - 01:07:08
So yes, you can definitely get that. Subscribe to that.
Wayne Herring01:07:08 - 01:07:18
Okay, that's great. Well, thanks again for joining us on our business builder Way podcast. And to all the business builders out there that are building and creating, go get them. Thanks Brian.
Brian Mininger01:07:18 - 01:07:20
It's great to be here.
Wayne Herring01:07:20 - 01:07:40
Yeah, take care. Thank you for tuning into the Business Builder Way podcast. If this episode spoke to you, click that subscribe button and share it with a how this message gets out into the world. If it is helpful for us to have a short conversation, I'd love to do that. Send me an email at wayne@businessbuildercamp.com.

00:00 Curious about friend's significant running achievement.

07:31 Transitioned from marathons to preparing for ultra.

13:03 Discussing running and transition into entrepreneurship journey.

17:39 Creating outdoor spaces for people's homes, business.

21:11 Success requires playing a strategic long game.

30:26 Offering support and encouragement to those struggling.

35:10 Focusing on present while still being visionary.

41:07 Intentional weekly planning and daily focus prayer.

45:28 Ignoring small problems leads to big consequences.

50:57 Fueling is crucial for endurance and performance.

55:16 Prioritizing self-care for better work performance.

01:02:23 Victoria found your journey inspiring, a gift.

01:06:16 Bear Creek promotes outdoor living through blog.

1. How did Brian Mininger's experience with ultra trail running impact his personal and business growth, and what lessons can business builders draw from it?
2. How did Brian's struggles with his physical health and burnout reflect in his entrepreneurial journey, and what strategies did he adopt to overcome these challenges?
3. In what ways did Brian Mininger's experiences with bankruptcy and depression influence his approach to perseverance and resilience in both endurance sports and business endeavors?
4. What parallels did Brian draw between the mental challenges of ultra racing and the struggles of managing a long-term business venture, and how did he approach overcoming these obstacles?
5. How did Brian and Victoria Mininger's shared experiences in personal and marital challenges influence their collaborative efforts in both business and creative endeavors, and what insights can be gleaned from their journey?
6. What role did the support system play in Brian's accomplishments, and how can business builders leverage support networks to navigate their own challenges and hurdles?
7. What was the significance of Brian's reflective journaling following the ultra race, and how can business leaders apply this practice to facilitate personal growth and development?
8. How did Brian's emphasis on "playing the long game" resonate with his experiences in both relationships and business, and what practical implications does this mindset have for entrepreneurial success?
9. In what ways did Brian and Wayne's discussion on seeking inspiration from personal challenges and adversity parallel their experiences in both the endurance sports arena and the business world?
10. How did Wayne's connection to Victoria Mininger's book and his personal experiences with challenges in marriage and business add depth to the themes explored in this episode, and what insights can be drawn from these shared stories?